Allow Fireteam & Predator to see loadouts.

[Eshtion]

@KameofWar

because trying things to solve a problem is good even if it doesn’t solve the problem as you can always rollback or use the information gathered to try something else

When the solution fails under basic logic try something else

@KameofWar

no one wants to run things that hinder their capabilities around others no one would purposely handicap themselves around players that they perceive as similar to them if they had the choice to do so

So…

People don’t run heavies

So why do we need this system to stop people from running heavies?

@KameofWar

when balance between the hunters and everyone else is so wide no one would use the other classes unless they knew the players they were up against were of simaler skill to balance out the skill

Then why doesn’t everyone just run the meta

And if they do then why are you trying to advocate for a change that does nothing

Seriously your point was

1. I want to know if FT are noobs so I can meme/casauls play

@KameofWar

ah ok there tryharding so i’m going to run a try hard hunter/city hunter loadout

or oh ok there just a haphazard squad so i’ll run some meme shit

2. My point is that they’ll mind game you into a meme build

@Eshtion

Now you just got baited into running a meme build against a death squad

3. Your point is then everyone will run good builds and this will make heavies used less making it clear that they suck

@KameofWar

and it looks like i solved this when i said if this happens too much people just will always run Hunter/City Hunter cause then you can’t get baited into bad classes lol and then heavies don’t get played anymore

4. My point is that why not just run the meta now

@Eshtion

Why not just do that now…

@Eshtion

No because there’s still going to be heavies around who don’t care about death squads just like how there are heavies right now who don’t care about death squads.

5. Your point is that people do run the meta

@KameofWar

same reason why 97% of MMO players simply run whatever is the best meta builds available
no one wants to run things that hinder their capabilities around others no one would purposely handicap themselves around players that they perceive as similar to them if they had the choice to do so

Your point 5 and 3 contradict each other and your point one is contradicted by mind games.

[KameofWar]

point 5 and 3 do not contradict each other point 3 is people will be incentivized to run memes if they have the option to gauge the skill of the opposing players

point 5 is if system is abused bad classes are played less which in turn feeds data that bad classes need buffs or good classes need nerfs
whereas right now zerker is unequivocally the weakest class in the game and hasn’t been buffed over the course of 9 months and the specs given to the zerker this patch are literally the worst of all specs offered to the predator

if system fails totally because of possibilities of players mindgaming each other into oblivion where nothing changes just rollback
anything is better than current system which fails currently and trying something is better than trying nothing

oh and in point 4 players currently play meta and some players only play meta cause they have no way of knowing what a bad player looks like right now so players like me always run meta destroy teams in first encounter than 1 or 2 players leave cause they feel as though they couldn’t win at all
if there was a way for me to KNOW that the players i’m up against aren’t always good i could risk running meme loadouts that wouldn’t wreck teams as soon as i see them

cause players can lose before game begins due to lack of information if it came down to it we could force players to only be able to swap a limited number of times in lobby

even though it does stand that SBMM would solve this issue totally which i agree however i know they will not add such a system unless it was a separate que

[Robo_2696]

If anything I’d love to see what everyone had post-mach, would include those who DCed or left.

[Eshtion]

@KameofWar

point 5 is if system is abused bad classes are played less which in turn feeds data that bad classes need buffs or good classes need nerfs
whereas right now zerker is unequivocally the weakest class in the game and hasn’t been buffed over the course of 9 months

@KameofWar

same reason why 97% of MMO players simply run whatever is the best meta builds available
no one wants to run things that hinder their capabilities around others no one would purposely handicap themselves around players that they perceive as similar to them if they had the choice to do so

@KameofWar

when balance between the hunters and everyone else is so wide no one would use the other classes unless they knew the players they were up against were of simaler skill to balance out the skill diffrence it’s why in MOBAS people only try absurdist comps at very low rankings

Your point five was that people don’t run bad stuff

But hey let’s take what you say

@KameofWar

point 5 is if system is abused bad classes are played less

What about all the people right now who play bad classes dispite the risk of elite squads?

This system doesn’t do anything because of mind games ruining it.

So it’s literally no different

@KameofWar

point 3 is people will be incentivized to run memes if they have the option to gauge the skill of the opposing players

Mind games

@KameofWar

if system fails totally because of possibilities of players mindgaming each other into oblivion where nothing changes just rollback
anything is better than current system

Except for the time it takes to implement. Which ya it shouldn’t be a lot but this is a small indie company with little game experience…

And you want something that on paper does nothing just to try it?

@KameofWar

cause players can lose before game begins due to lack of information

No that’s just you going easy…

Just run good builds

Revealing builds doesn’t solve this

If you lose because of loadout loss that’s your fault for not taking the game seriously enough.

[KameofWar]

@Eshtion

If you lose because of loadout loss that’s your fault for not taking the game seriously enough.

i’m glad you agree with me lol

please don’t bother arguing incessantly with me if you run out of things to say
i’m not going to run down an oblivion dialogue tree with someone who just wants to be a contrarian

your only standing argument is “But mindgames tho” which i’ve addressed

and “what if system does nothing?” and i addressed that too

while mine is but isn’t it worth trying? and you say “no because might do nothing”

when i fundamentally believe if problem exists and a potential solution exists you should try it even if it does nothing as long as it costs nothing but time (inb4 you say it would cost dev money) and is reversible and doesn’t cause damage
because even if it fails you can go back and learn from it to try something else

we are 3 statements in and we just keep repeating ad nauseum
great cool where done stop responding jesus

neither of our answers are satisfactory towards each other and that’s fine

[Fire]

While if it lead to bad classes getting biggs, that would be nice. I also hate the counter building bullshit in mobas.

A lot of no skill pieces of shit only win cause counter builds/picks.

So I dont really want that in here.
But if we knew of they were in a group or not,
That would at least give you enough of an idea to gauge what to use.

That’s how I see it anyway.

[Eshtion]

@KameofWar

please don’t bother arguing incessantly with me if you run out of things to say

You complained about losing because of loadout loss

I told you it was your own fault

@KameofWar

i’m not going to run down an oblivion dialogue tree with someone who just wants to be a contrarian

Take a look at the poll again.

Now yes having people agree with me doesn’t disprove I’m not a contrarian but what’s more likely

I’m a contrarian with no evidence

Or I’m one of the majority of people who disagree with you.

@KameofWar

your only standing argument is “But mindgames tho” which i’ve adressed

Yes

@KameofWar

and it looks like i solved this when i said if this happens too much people just will always run Hunter/City Hunter cause then you can’t get baited into bad classes lol and then heavies don’t get played anymore

But

@Eshtion

No because there’s still going to be heavies around who don’t care about death squads just like how there are heavies right now who don’t care about death squads.

There. And what’s your response?

Nothing

In fact you claimed that people don’t like to handicap themselves

@KameofWar

same reason why 97% of MMO players simply run whatever is the best meta builds available
no one wants to run things that hinder their capabilities

Of course you claim this point was

@KameofWar

point 5 is if system is abused bad classes are played less which in turn feeds data that bad classes need buffs

So let’s take that as is.

Which is a repeat of your argument that if the system fails it’ll at least cause heavy pick rates to drop prompting a buff.

@KameofWar

we are 3 statements in and we just keep repeating ad nauseum

You repeated the argument. Or at least you claimed the argument was that.

@KameofWar

and “what if system does nothing?” and i addressed that too

@KameofWar

while mine is but isn’t it worth trying? and you say “no because might do nothing”

THIS IS ILLFONIC

THEY’RE BARELY CAPABLE OF RELEASING AN UPDATE WITH LITTLE BUGS YET YOU TRUST THEM TO THROW EVERY IDEA WE HAVE AT THE WALL WITH THE LITTLE TIME WHERE THEY’RE CAPABLE OF ACTUALLY DOING SOMETHING

and I’m an Illfonic defender by the way

If they’re going to do something it better be good on paper because they’re time and skill is limited and with how much hate this game gets we need Illfonic working on things that’ll sway public opinion so this game starts moving forward.

Not to mention it’s not 'it might not work"

It’s it won’t work. That’s how confident I am in saying that.

Plus if something doesn’t work in theory to fix a problem…

Why don’t we look for another solution that does work in theory.

@KameofWar

we are 3 statements in and we just keep repeating ad nauseum

I’ve been entirely reacting here. My point is that your idea won’t work and the way I’ve been going about that is countering you points.

Heavies will still be popular, elites will mind game etc.

So why is it that your points require me to repeat myself?

@KameofWar

great cool where done stop responding jesus

Hey…

Why did you respond then. Your totally capable of not responding yourself.

Then again you need an arbitrary system implemented just so you can stop going easy

@KameofWar

neither of our answers are satisfactory towards each other and that’s fine

Yes that is fine…

Can we not have a discussion though???

Or are you losing and trying to end the argument???

Now yes that claim is baseless but you calling me a contrarian…

Is also baseless.

So ya I’m a contrarian (which doesn’t even mean I’m wrong if it even is true) and your trying to get out of a losing argument

[Eshtion]

@KameofWar

oh and in point 4 players currently play meta and some players only play meta cause they have no way of knowing what a bad player looks like right now

Missed this argument

They still won’t know because elites will just pretend to be noobs.

So the rate of noobs to elites will be the same

[Cadillackid]

This right here.
Pre game show us if party members are grouped, post game show us build info

[Slade_Viscus]

I sometimes use the default Hunter as a tactic to make some fire teams split apart and think I’m a noob and then I just completely wreck them when they’re alone lol

[Slut_Master_X]

Frens have spoken