Call for cooperation: Sister Frieda at level 54 DS3

#41

Literally, all I’m hearing is that you dont like fighting groups of enemies.

Il give it to you if we’re talking about remnant from the ashes, cause every boss is non stop groups of enemies. But it’s done so you can get more ammo.

Given the low amount of ammo you get in that game.
However, that’s not the case in dark souls 2.
Some bosses are like that, not all.

And no.
That’s just wrong.
Ds it’s not at its best when its 1v1.

Some 1v1 fights are good.
Others that have groups are good as well.
Sure they can be annoying, but they’re still good/ cool.

So no, nothing you said sounds good at all, at explaining it. It’s a different type of challenge.
Sometimes the challange is being overwhelmed.
Sometimes its one strong enemy.

Honestly I completely disagree with whatvyouve said, and I definitely Dont want you designing a souls game lol.

We lose out on all the group fights which would be boring.

Sounds to me like youd rather play dmc.

#42

I literally gave an example of a good gank fight

Here’s more

Abyss watchers
Gargoyles
The undead burg in general

I was specific to mention a particular style of ganks

Dark souls is about learning enemy movesets

Generic crowd fights put an empthesis on environmental advantage

Think of the sorcerer battle in the church

It’s just mindless hack and slash with no mechanical difficulty

Artorias
Soul of Cinder
Vordt
Gundyr
Champion Gundyr
Pontiff Sullivan
Nameless king
Phase one and three of Friede
Kalameet
Midir
Gael
Qualaag
Sir Alonne
Sir O&S and Abyss watchers stand up there with them but one V one fights dominate

O&S

Abyss watchers

Gargoyles

Cool and annoying are subjective

What’s the added value of generic mobs?

There’s being overwhelmed then there’s the generic hack and slash chokepoint

Take the 3 hollows outside the church

There’s two swordsmen and an archer

Imagine if they were syched up so that the archer timed his shots to cover the recovery frames of a swordsman’s swing, forcing you to dodge the shot afterwards, then punish

You can enhance generic mob fights to be actual encounters that you can learn

Granted I may of been a but overzealous when I said if remove most mob fights

No I want to play the one V one game that everyone loves

Why do you love mob fights so much?

And I also remember you saying something that made me think you thought the games were designed to be hard for the sake of being hard which they’re not so where do you stand on the purpose of these games?

#43

Lol you seem to like a challenge but I also have a feeling you have a lot more trouble in stuff I consider easy.

Such as the hollow knight bat boss.
That looked pretty easy.

One v one fights are inherently easier,
So uh… who’s after the challange now?

Oh I get what you’re saying with enemies doing kind of like a planned strategy, but uh.
Were talking dark souls here.

Theres no real counter Mechanic. It’s just dodge til you get an opening.
So line up enemies the way you’re talking, and you get having to dodge the entire time, maybe get one attack in, repeat the cycle.
Which is fine for bosses, but you want that for regular enemies?

The way you’re talking, that’s a test of patience,
not skill.

Lmao I find it hilarious that you dont see that you’re basically talking about dmc.

You mentioned a lot of bosses from ds.
Like ya. Theres good 1v1, but the group ones add a different challenge.

It’s a nice change of pace.

Why do I like group fights?
Because i like seeing more than one type of fight.

Sure you can say cool is subjective, but while some of the fights are good and stand out in souls, really doesnt compare to how good/cool fighting virgil in dmc 3 was.

And why is that fight way more memorable than any of the ds ones?
Because its built better.

The combat is made to be really intense and skillful.
Theres more to it.

Dark souls is too simple to really push you and truly test your skill.

You keep talking about skill and generic mobs.

I’m sorry, damn near the entire cast of ds is generic.

You put nameless king as an example Of a good 1v1.
Like how?

Oh don’t get me wrong. Hes cool.
But a good fight?
Hes literally One of the easiest bosses ever.

Even without magic.
And yes, it isnt a thought.
The souls series is literally Designed just to try to be hard, to revive the old school challenge Of games, but play games enough, and the series wont really be that hard.

On the subject of generic, things Have been done so many times, that pretty much everything Is generic at this point.

Characters, plots, personalities, powers/abilities/skills, ect.

And honestly. For a huge part of the souls series.
The most challenging parts, are The ones with multiple Enemies, not single ones.

Also, some of those fights aren’t really designed to be all that hard.

Put it this way, you try to make every enemy in a game with a lot of enemies unique, then what’s the point of bosses?

Who will truly stand out then?
The “generic” mobs play their role.
It helps the special enemies be just that.
Special.

Think about it. Cause it applies in real life too.
How many people actually Stand out?

Not many.
Definitely To me, theres very, VERY few people I have ever considered Unique.
So I suppose its art imitating life, no?

#44

Plenty of people say it’s difficult

I think your better than you think

Compare the sorcerer fight at the top of the church in DS1 to Artorias

Or Friede

In fact compare Friede phase two to phase three

You can literally just rush down Andriel while Gael distracts Friede

Not to mention it ignores single enemies capable of making multiple projectiles while attacking like Gael

Plus were not talking difficulty although that is important

We’re talking quality

Mob fights takes empthesis away from movesets since you can’t just dodge the combo and punish

Yes

The empthesis of the combat is learning the enemies moveset that’s why this game is at its best in one V one

Because that’s when learning the enemies moveset is important

That’s was an oversimplified example

But even if it wasn’t dodging combo’s is just patience? Whatever happened to Friede?

As for fighting enemies in cycles they’d still be just as soft, just mechanically stronger.

So you dodge dodge strike strike dudes dead move on to the archer strike strike

So there wouldn’t be any cycles really

Never played

But isn’t DMC based around mob fights (outside bosses) and advanced combo’s?

The problem isn’t mobs it’s generic mobs

Again I’m questioning your confidence in yourself

You get what I mean

The mobs where you use the environment to make a hack and slash.

And if your point is dark souls is generic then that’s

A. A what’s aboutism

B. They’re generic but that’s not the problem. The problem is they take away from DS’s core gameplay

Mainly his second phase

He has a bunch of delays

You really have to learn his moveset

I again question you why you undervalue yourself

So you beat him first try or second try and pretty much read his moves as they came?

A. The game is difficult for the sake of enforcing you to learn not difficult to be difficult

B. It wasn’t even originally intended to be difficult. At least both DS’s

So by both metrics of intention and design your wrong

Well ya that’s all games

The only way to garuntee difficulty is by making it artificial.

That’s why no death runs and no hit runs are possible and enjoyed by people

This puts challenge over design

They wouldn’t be as challenging or as tanky

We already have this with the giant undead, and Lothric knights

This would just allow mob fights to be alongside those ones

And yes the giant undead are easy

Plus bosses still have style points for a psychological difference

#45

I didn’t bother reading either of you nerd’s essays so I’ll just say this, DS2 (scholar edition, never played original) does have an over reliance on gank fights. I’m not necessarily talking about boss fights but of regular enemies. In 1&3 there are gank fights too ie undead burg, or the dark wood forest area but in 2s case it’s like that for a good majority of the game.

I love DS2 but it always felt a but odd, the multiplayer was the only one where I honestly ever gave a shot aside from random invasions. Iron keep bridge was where it’s at.

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#46

Considering gank fights,
Theres literally only like a few that completely stand out in ds 2.

But it didnt feel more or less than ds 1 or ds 3.
It demon souls for that matter.

#47

Honestly, as for my skill.
I start out a bit better than most ppl, but most of my results are because I’ve always pushed myself harder than most people.

So while after years of gaming things come a bit easier to me, and I catch on quicker, it’s not cause it’s super natural to me or anything.

Some games I will literally spend practicing, doing over and over until I finally understand it.

I did it in ds 2 my first play through.
I dont think I died a lot, but I spent like an hour practicing the dodging in the tower of flame.

It paid off tho, barely had trouble after that.

As for the groups.
I dont think I made it clear.
It’s just that Iike variety.

That’s literally All it is.
I like bad ass one v one fights, but I also enjoy killing groups.

It’s like I said, in armies, or large forces, not everyone will be special or stand out.

So it makes sense to have grunts and minions.

I found more challange in fighting multiple Ppl, compared to the 1v1s.

Also, try devil may cry bro.
Its exactly what you’re talking about.
Theres going to be a lot of easy minions, but youl love the boss fights.

I recommend dmc, dmc 3, dmc 4 and 5.

You can skip 2 if you want.

Btw I’m not the only one who’s said souls is easy xD

#48

Yep you underestimate yourself

That’s fine

It’s just a particular style of ganks fights I don’t like

Can we stick with the O&S and Abyss watchers gank styles?

Well ya but they usually mean it’s about learning

Your coming in and just blowing the whole thing down

#49

Nah, not just me lol.
Honestly not even trying to be cocky, I just find ds easy.
Except ds 1.
That one was hell for me.

Ds 2 and 3 though, nowhere near as bad.

I still want the ones where you have a lot enemies.
Basically I just want it to keep all of them, different fights I mean.
I gotta replay ds 1 some day.

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#50

Going back to this

Would you say the regular edition of DS2 is worth 25 dollars more than the Scholar edition or is that a rip off?

Also is DS one of the games where even if your on PC you still play it with controller?

If so is there a mod that fixes the movement?

#51

Man I love the original, so to me, yes.
Honestly I would say play both.

Scholar adds another ending/ end boss.

Its kind of like ocarina of time and ocarina of time master quest.

And yes.
Most games I’m definitely Using a controller.
Preference Thing tho.

As for fix the movement, lmao you’re already sounding like a pc player, cant do the original, no, have to modify Everything lmao.

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#52

Ooh that is important

I’d like to actually have everything even if it is small

How much worse is scholar? Why is it worse?

Why am I annoying you with all these questions :p

IF SOMETHING CAN BE BETTER

WHY SHOULDN’T I MAKE IT BETTER

#53

These questions arent annoying, I’m just hopefully giving you enough info to go off of.

The original just felt better in terms of enemy placement and the location of some items.

It was a bunch of weird and seemingly random changes from original to scholar.

Also, because if you’re just changing in game settings sure, but if you have to mod the game to change up how it was developed, well, that’s kind of saying im good enough to do it as it was intended, I needed heeeeelp.

Wah I’m a pc player that needs to modify games or I’m useleeeessss.

XD.

Lord knows how many ppl will get pissed at that.

Honestly I dont really care.
I’m just not big on mods.

I do like visual mods tho.
Sometimes.

I think I would play a modded ds 2 however.
Like a version that added more to the game.
But this is only because I’ve literally beaten it like 6 or 7 times.

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#54

So I’d definitely do your first playthrough no mods

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#55

Oh please

360 movement doesn’t provide an advantage it just feels nicer

Other than platforming but DS isn’t exactly a platformer is it

Would you say scholar is a bad experience?

My expectations for finding undead death horses in royal castles is already there so random placement isn’t going to bother me (if that’s what you mean and not changes made to be made)

I’m not even on PC yet and I’m triggered

hollowknight-hk

Nub uh I got a visual lighting rework mod saved already

Looks beautiful

And I’m the guy who said DS2 was ugly

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#56

Scholar isnt a bad experience tho.

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#57

You say that as if I said it was

Alright I did but the comment you responded too was a question

#58

Wut?

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#59

We’re both idiots

Or I’m an idiot

Or your an idiot

Or some combination of the three

IDK

yd8le0eurg431
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#60

Damn it, this conversation has broken you.
Lol

1 Like